The Prime Minister spoke about the European positions related to Ukraine as an opinion debate. He said when the others say that this is our war, Ukraine is our first line of defence, “therefore, we are at war,” therefore we must support Ukraine, it means that we must indeed support Ukraine: we must send weapons, money, and later perhaps also men to Ukraine, and we must support the continuation of the fighting, as a result of which hundreds and thousands are dying every day.
The strategy presented in Copenhagen, too, is based on a flawed assumption, he laid down.
He said this strategy claims that the Russians will run out of money sooner than the Europeans, they will not have enough money to make weapons. At the same time, Europe will be able to supply the Ukrainians with large quantities of money and weapons. The Russians will be broken economically, perhaps, there will even be uprisings, and so the Russians will have to abandon their war objectives, will retreat, and then the Ukrainians will be able to take back the occupied territories, one fifth of the country, he said.
He added that every day hundreds or even thousands of people were dying. Every day, many millions of euros are being burnt, billions eventually, and there is a continual risk that “we Europeans, too, will become ever more deeply involved in the war,” and in the end, those will prevail who even want to send soldiers.
Mr Orbán said the strategy of the European Union will have grave consequences for the whole of Europe, while the strategy itself fails to clarify two key questions: How long will the war last and how much will it cost?
When will the Russians collapse? Next month? In six months’ time, in a year’s time, or in three or four years’ time? How many people will die? He listed the questions, pointing out that so far the EU has spent EUR 170 to 180 billion; meanwhile, Europe is in serious economic trouble, would need every penny, and would be required to spend another EUR 40 to 60 billion every year while it has no money.
This strategy has no reasonable, rational basis, we are unable to finance this war, and meanwhile, we want to defeat the enemy by saying that we will last longer financially and economically than they will, he stated in summary. He said “the whole thing is a mirage, an illusion, it will collapse, and there will be grave consequences.”
Mr Orbán said it is unprecedented in the history of wars that the opposing parties are not talking to each other. The Americans are talking to the Russians, but the Europeans are not, despite the fact that the war is here on the European continent, he added.
He stated: the Hungarian position is that we strive for a ceasefire, we strive for peace, and there should be ongoing diplomatic talks between the parties.
He highlighted that ever more countries had the same feeling as Hungary, that we would drift into a war, and “sooner or later, coffins will be coming back home, with our youths killed on the front in them.” This threat keeps increasing, and they do not want that, he pointed out.
Mr Orbán also spoke about the fact that every nation has the right to decide whether they want to be in the same union with another nation. The Hungarians need not worry about what the other 26 EU Member States say, we must concern ourselves with our own opinion, we must know what the Hungarians want. The Hungarians do not want to be in a European Union with the Ukrainians, he stated, adding that he fully agreed with this.
If you are in an alliance with someone, you share their fate, and Ukraine has a very difficult fate. Why should we share this difficult fate? he asked, pointing out that we have our own fate which is much easier than the Ukrainians’.
We feel sorry for them, we empathise with them, they are fighting heroically, we should support them, but we do not want a shared fate with them, he laid down.
He pointed out that their fate was that they lived next to Russia and were continually at war with the Russians. We cannot change that, and it is no help if we take upon ourselves that which they are suffering from. He said he wants to spare Hungary the fate of sharing an alliance with the Ukrainians and finding itself at war with the Russians.
If you are in an alliance with someone and they are attacked, sooner or later, you have to send soldiers, and we do not want to die for Ukraine, he stated.
He also said as regards money, we only want to send as much as we can. We will decide whether we want to give them money, and if so, how much, but they cannot lay a claim to taking money out of the Hungarian people’s pockets because they need this, he pointed out.
He suggested that they conclude a strategic agreement with the Ukrainians and help them. There are such agreements with Britain and Turkey as well, meaning that this is not unprecedented, but Ukraine should not be admitted to the EU. Regardless of any solution Brussels may invent, the Hungarians – the same as any other nation – have a right to this position, he stressed.
He also spoke about the fact that Hungary was divided on the issue of Ukraine’s EU membership, recalling the Tisza Party vote where 58 per cent said yes to this question.
If there is a national government, we will not go to war, we will not send our money there; if Tisza or DK [Democratic Coalition] – which are pro-Brussels parties – forms a government, then we will go to war, and will also send money there, he stated, stressing that this will be one of the most important stakes of the elections.
He further said that Hungary will be under continual pressure on the issue of the war, this is why it is important that the Hungarians keep confirming their opinion that they reject the EU’s war strategy.
We wanted to stay out of two world wars, and did not succeed in staying out of either World War I or World War II because while our leaders wanted to, they did not succeed, he recalled.
The essence of the government’s economic policy is to use all possible economic tools for helping families, Mr Orbán stated. Regarding the tax-exemption of mothers with three children in effect from October, the Prime Minister highlighted that there was the simple thought behind this measure that if not enough children were born, we would disappear. In the case of a country the size of Hungary, each generation where fewer children are born than people dying is a hazard.
A shrinking country cannot be successful, and so how many we are in Hungary is an existential issue not only on a historical horizon, but due to the economy, also in the short term, he pointed out.
The Prime Minister said there are two options for solving this problem. There is the path of the West where migrants are imported, saying “one person is one person,” if there are fewer German or French people, then Muslims will come in their place. He indicated that he would not advise us to embark on this path. Others have already tried it before us, we can see what has happened to those who let migrants in, and what we observe in Western Europe today is not attractive. He observed that “we did the right thing by lying low and not letting strangers in.”
He pointed out that in that case, we needed children of our own. It is everybody’s own business how many children they have, the state has no say in that. “We can do one thing: we recognise and support mothers who decide to have at least two children – which means that they have one child to replace themselves and another their husbands, meaning that they sustain their community – and do not allow them to be any worse off just because they had two children than those who did not have any, he added.
This is a pro-family country, we love children, and are sorry that there are not enough. But the government is not there to feel sorry, but to help people to have more. This involves social considerations, fairness, family support and demography all at once.
If Hungary has money – and will have in the future – it must spend it primarily on helping families, the Prime Minister stated.
Responding to accusations that Hungary does not have the money to grant even mothers with two children personal income tax exemption, Mr Orbán said the budget clearly shows that there is sufficient coverage for family support both this year and next year.
In the Prime Minister’s view, Tisza, the liberals and DK continually want to scrap the bank levy and want to reduce the taxes of multinational companies because this is what Brussels demands as, due to the war in Ukraine, the European Union needs ever more money, and the next seven-year EU budget, too, is about a quarter of all money going to Ukraine.
DK has always been pro-Brussels, while Tisza is “a party that was founded in Brussels,” they will always support whatever Brussels asks for, he pointed out.
Mr Orbán described taxation as the most important issue of Hungary’s future.
“If Tisza keeps hiding in the shadows and doesn’t want to state openly, but only accidently lets it slip here or there, that they want to close down hospitals, they want to close down schools, they would take away the tax donations for sports because, according to them, we spend too much on sports, they want to take money away from culture, and want to take money away from families, then let’s talk about this because they don’t want to talk about it,” Mr Orbán said, pointing out that the national consultation is a suitable means for discussing these issues.
He stressed that, in the government’s view, it was best to take as little money away from the people as possible and to leave as much with them as possible. Taxes should be low, and we should give back the taxes that we collect primarily to families, he added.
In response to the news that in a video, Tisza Party Vice President Zoltán Tarr spoke about ‘changing’ the number of hospital beds and primary schools, the Prime Minister said he has been a Member of Parliament since 1990, has attended budget debates for 35 years, and in his experience, there are only two positions regarding the utilisation of funds. And those who stand for these positions keep re-emerging.
In connection with one, he mentioned György Surányi who is regarded as an educated economist, but he emerges sometimes behind the Bokros Package, sometimes behind Tisza, “he sometimes appears here, sometimes there,” similar to Péter Ákos Bod. Mr Orbán also mentioned András Kármán, Tisza’s economic expert, whom he described as “a banker paid from abroad,” and recalled that as prime minister, he “sacked” him from the government sometime in 2011.
“I know them all like the back of my hand,” he said, stressing that they have always stood for the idea that Hungary needs an economy which gives multinationals a lot of money, does not levy taxes on banks, does not levy special sector-specific taxes, increases the burdens of families and thereby creates an economic balance. This is now “backed up by Brussels” which has a vested interest in this state of affairs, and “they together constitute a very powerful intellectual and political bloc” which sometimes even succeeds in entering into power in Hungary.
“But then we thoroughly defeat them, we come along and then we restore the pro-family policy,” he said, adding that these are the only two options for Hungary.
The Prime Minister was also asked about Hungarian-Slovak relations, recalling that last week, 16 years after former President of the Republic László Sólyom had been banned from Slovakia, he celebrated the 130th anniversary of the inauguration of the Marie Valerie Bridge together with Slovak Prime Minister Robert Fico. Mr Orbán said, today there is far more agreement than disagreement between Slovakia and Hungary, and Brussels is the reason why relations between the two countries have changed this much in 16 years. Because Brussels is centralising, “it’s invading our lives, and all nations protest against this.” Due to this, the Slovaks and the Hungarians are in the same boat, Mr Orbán explained.
