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He described Mr Trump’s return to politics as advantageous for Hungary as the former pressure from Brussels and Washington had lessened as a result. At the same time, he criticised the EU due to its economic and security policy weaknesses, while he urged pragmatic cooperation with Russia, dismissing the sanctions as ineffectual. He stressed that Hungary could not rely solely on Europe economically; we must equally foster relations with China and other emerging powers.
In answer to the newspaper’s question relating to Mr Trump’s return, Mr Orbán observed that thanks to “the Trump tornado,” in just ten days the world had changed as much as in years before, and at that, in Hungary’s favour. “We were the West’s black sheep. By now, it has transpired that what Trump is doing and what we have been doing in the past fifteen years is the future,” he said.
In light of recent changes, Mr Orbán hopes for closer cooperation with the United States, in particular, on economic issues. “We sincerely hope that the Americans will again invest more in our country. They have recently even fallen behind China,” he pointed out.
At the same time, he criticised the Democrats’ approach to Hungary. “The Democrats hated us,” he said. We had contrary positions on issues such as migration, gender and the war in Ukraine, he listed. “They supported all organisations and media in Hungary which were against me. Trump put an end to this,” the Prime Minister explained.
In the interview, Mr Orbán warned that Europe could not rely on the United States unless it made an attractive offer for cooperation. “Sitting and waiting is not a solution. We must come up with ideas. Europe may well be rich, but it’s also weak,” he said. With Mr Trump’s return, the “peace dividend” of recent decades has come to an end, he added.
He stressed that Hungary pursued a policy of balance between the West, China and Russia. Mr Orbán took the view that the United States and China would come to an agreement sooner or later, while smaller nations like Hungary would have to remain flexible. “I grew up during the Cold War. My experience was that the two great players would always come to an arrangement,” he said. The situation with Russia is more complex because the EU is blocking economic cooperation. “The US position is unclear for the time being. We must wait and see,” the Prime Minister said.
In the interview, Mr Orbán said he is convinced that the West is losing ground economically and politically. “As far as the economy is concerned, we’re living in a world where there is no western supremacy. The EU is continually losing competitiveness. It has no strategy and it has no leadership. What’s happening here is embarrassing. The dynamic of the world economy is in the East,” he explained. “If Hungary only maintains economic relations with Europe, that’s crazy,” Mr Orbán argued.
He added that Europe should be “more modest.” “The EU keeps saying that it’s a global actor. But it’s not even able to control developments in its own neighbourhood. Neither were we able to prevent the Russo-Ukrainian war, nor were we able to integrate the Western Balkans,” he stated. He said a strong EU foreign policy would only be possible with the firm leadership of Germany and France, but that is lacking.
Mr Orbán is opposed to the sanctions against Russia as they severely affect Hungary economically. “In the past three years, we have lost 19.5 billion euros because we have been compelled to restrict trade and energy prices have risen. Hungary has suffered more due to the sanctions than Russia,” he pointed out.
In answer to a question related to his vote for the extension of the sanctions against Russia, Mr Orbán said “we have received assurances that Brussels will support the resumption of gas transit via Ukraine and will continue to make the transit of oil possible.” While these promises are “vague, they are better than nothing,” he said.
“We also support renewable energy sources and electrification. But we need Russia as a supplier, Mr Orbán laid down. “In recent years, we have invested in pipelines in almost all neighbouring countries. Additionally, we will soon start receiving more gas and oil from Romania, Azerbaijan and Turkey,” the Prime Minister explained.
Mr Orbán described the western strategy in the war in Ukraine as flawed. He believes a Ukrainian victory is not a realistic option unless a total war breaks out which is, in his view, out of the question. Instead, we need a ceasefire which can only be achieved by a strong leader such as Donald Trump, he pointed out. “If you’re facing a Gordian knot, you must cut it. You need a strong man who has a sword. It’s no longer about what kinds of ideas we have. Trump must sit down with Russia and Ukraine and must tell them ‘Guys, let’s conclude a ceasefire. That’s the only solution.’ Weak leaders cause wars, strong ones create peace,” Mr Orbán said.
In the interview, Mr Orbán stressed that over the years he had concluded reliable agreements with Putin. While other countries had negative experiences with Russia, Hungary was always able to defend its interests. “We concluded a number of agreements. Putin always kept his word. The experience of the past fifteen years is that Hungary can trust Russia,” he said, adding that “but I’m not a friend of Russia, I’m a friend of Hungary.” According to Mr Orbán, the EU should focus more on diplomacy, instead of prioritising moral principles over practical solutions.
Mr Orbán took the view that Brussels is more of a challenge for Hungary than Moscow is. “It’s easy to conclude rational agreements with Russia. With the Brusselites it’s almost impossible.” He criticised the EU for interfering with domestic politics in Hungary, especially in the areas of migration and the rule of law. They additionally apply double standards: while they punish Hungary for the protection of its borders, they readily accept similar measures adopted by other countries, he pointed out.
The Hungarian Prime Minister believes that the European Right is on the rise. Fidesz distanced itself from the European People’s Party (EPP) because in his view it has shifted to the left. Fidesz is now relying on the alliance of other right-wing parties such as the French National Rally and the Italian Lega. “In a few years’ time, Europe will look differently than today,” he said.
Regarding the German party Alternative for Germany (AfD), Mr Orbán said he approves of its policies in a number of areas and rejects the policy of isolation used in German politics. “In Hungary there is no firewall. If a party receives votes, we take that seriously. This doesn’t mean that we work together with them. But we sit down and talk. The firewall approach reduces political thinking to a primitive level,” he said.
“We don’t have any experience with AfD, and we don’t have relations with them. Their programme sounds good to Hungary: tax cuts, the replanning of the green deal, a return to nuclear energy, a strict migration policy. But I don’t want to interfere in German affairs.” He added that co-chairwoman and candidate for chancellor of AfD Alice Weidel called him and asked him for a meeting. “I will receive her in Budapest next week. AfD could obtain 20 per cent of the votes. If their leader wants to talk to me, why should I say no?” the Prime Minister said.
In answer to a question about Péter Magyar, Mr Orbán observed that “in a democracy, you must always prepare for political opponents. Even if you – as in us – win almost half of the votes, the others are cast for someone else. That’s not unusual,” he said.
As to whether the swift emergence of the opponent could be related to increasing economic problems, Mr Orbán admitted that “yes, indeed. The war and the sanctions have created a very difficult situation in the past three years, with high inflation, increased energy prices and low growth. I don’t like war for many reasons, including for economic reasons,” the Prime Minister explained.
“The prosecution service refuses to start investigations in many suspicious cases. Why is Hungary the only country in the EU that is not prepared to join the European Public Prosecutor’s Office? This could create more confidence,” the journalist of Neue Zürcher Zeitung asked.
In his answer, Mr Orbán pointed out that this was an issue of sovereignty. “In contrast to most countries of the European Union, in Hungary the prosecution service is accountable to Parliament, not to the government. This, too, is an issue of sovereignty. I will never accept a legal system in which proceedings are conducted against Hungarian citizens by authorities other than the Hungarian ones. This is impossible even on the basis of the Fundamental Law. We lived under Soviet rule and we were forced to surrender our sovereignty regarding criminal proceedings. For us, this is a matter of principle,” he pointed out.
